Derek Bailey, Evan Parker, et al

Not an error as such, but been trawlin' through the avant-garde section of the site and noticed Derek Bailey in this section. Of his solo works I think most would fit more comfortably in the 'Jazz influenced improvisation'. Evan Parker is less clear cut flitting back and forth tho' much of the time teetering on the cusp of both free jazz 'n' free improvisation. Is there the feature of multiply tagging? These are just two big examples, but there's a sizable 'grey area' (as the genre definition mentions) when discussion free-jazz, free improv, efi, etcetera.   

Cool, just trying to get a bit more of a grasp of this sites views on the matter, as my personal line of where Jazz (the avant-garde kind) stops in this grey area is a little further up the road (so it seems). From the above explanation would AMM, Spontaneous Music Ensemble, Gruppo d'Improvvisazione Nuova Consonanza, et cetera fall under the avant-garde jazz flag?     

Yeah, might be good to open another thread or something. Regarding Evan Parker I'm more comfortable about his positioning than Bailey's solo works (I think many his collaborative works are a different story). His solo guitar albums, especially his earlier ones were far more interested in the capabilities of his instrument (hard not to see Keith the influence, tho' not quite so far removed from the instrument itself), experimenting with timbre, tones 'n' unorthodox techniques (bad terminology but hopefully explanatory enough), which to me cut the line between avant-garde/free jazz, and free improvisation, whose key language is rooted in experimentation.

Sorry, this is all poor articulated, 'tis time for bed.

 

Katje wrote: Yeah, might be good to open another thread or something. Regarding Evan Parker I'm more comfortable about his positioning than Bailey's solo works (I think many his collaborative works are a different story). His solo guitar albums, especially his earlier ones were far more interested in the capabilities of his instrument (hard not to see Keith the influence, tho' not quite so far removed from the instrument itself), experimenting with timbre, tones 'n' unorthodox techniques (bad terminology but hopefully explanatory enough), which to me cut the line between avant-garde/free jazz, and free improvisation, whose key language is rooted in experimentation.

I'm not extensively familiar with either one's discography, but I don't see any relationship between the music of Keith Rowe and Derek Bailey. But I know what you are saying, Derek Bailey's primary early influence was Webern, he does not sound much like Albert Ayler and Ornette Coleman, and Derek himself seemed to want to think of what he did as "non-idiomatic improvisation" rather than anything else. But the rest of the world already decided that Derek Bailey played free jazz, so we have to live with that label. 

Go ahead and bring them on one at a time, some listening examples and a link with a little info really helps speed things up.