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Jazz Speaker /System Suggestions? |
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Peaceful World 33/3 ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Apr 2015 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 22 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 09 May 2015 at 7:20am |
I am redoing a room to listen to my vinyl. The system currently consists of a Pioneer SX101o Receiver and a pair of Pioneer 99A Speakers. My TT is a Project with a glass platter and speedbox.
I have another system I was thinking about using. NAD C352 amp, Monitor Audio Silver BookShelf Speakers and a MA powered Sub. Lector CDPO 6T CD Player, Project TT with a Musical Surroundings Phonomena II+ Phono Preamp Pioneer is a 1977 monster 110 Watt and the NAD is 2009 80 Watt. The main issue is the speakers. The Pioneer's sound is dull and lacks tonality on brass selections. The Monitor Audios are crisp and I can adjust the bottom end with the sub. My question, do I stay with the vintage Pioneer SX1010 that is from an all analog era and replace the 99's or go the NAD newer route? I listen to 50-early 70's jazz on Vinyl and get some newer releases on CD if there is no record. Thank You!
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js ![]() Forum Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site admin Joined: 22 Dec 2010 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 35854 |
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If you are listening to old vinyl, I would keep the analog record player, I'm no expert at all, but I do prefer any older acoustic music on vinyl.
I have several record players, the prize one being one of those heavy weighted technics that the DJs love. I like record players, and I have a large record collection, but I'm not particularly educated when it comes to technical audio information. I am fairly knowledgeable when it comes to record collecting, and I used to trade records a lot.
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snobb ![]() Forum Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: 22 Dec 2010 Location: Vilnius Status: Offline Points: 30361 |
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From my experience, Pioneer speakers (of any size) fit best for listening of dynamic mid-frequencies music,as pop,some rock,etc. Their sound is cold and lifeless,especially on highs and lows, and very flat as well (generally, as any other's Japanese mass-production speakers'). Have no idea how MA sound though.
After using some more modern devices (Technics,Sony,etc) I returned back to old Harman Kardon PM 645 amplifier (still Japan-made, not Chinese as they do now) in combination with Harman Kardon player (more modern though). The speakers I use for decade or more are Danish Jamo, nice black wooden boxes with warm and soft sound (absolutely prefer European sound-speakers, almost any make is much better of similar Japanese by head, just they are pricey) |
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Peaceful World 33/3 ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Apr 2015 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 22 |
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Monitor Audio Silver are from England. Mine are 2009 before they embraced Home Theatre. I love them and will sell the Pioneer 99A's on the Bay as there is a demand for them. Too me they are bloated and rather dull. http://www.trustedreviews.com/monitor-audio-silver-6av12-review
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snobb ![]() Forum Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: 22 Dec 2010 Location: Vilnius Status: Offline Points: 30361 |
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^ from the above review it looks MA speakers are good choice, British manufacturers knew how to produce good acoustic systems still from earlier Tannoy and Polk Audio makes.
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brewski ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() Joined: 19 May 2015 Location: Cincinnati, OH Status: Offline Points: 9 |
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I am punching My vinyls via pioneer turntable with a Pyle preamp,then to an Onkyo receiver,then to a Bose surround speaker system with a Yamaha sub woofer,It sounds great,You can email me for catalog numbers.
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diamondblack ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Feb 2016 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 102 |
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Well, if one wants to take jazz playback to almost realistic level, should consider Marten speakers. They are even named after Jazz player. www.marten.se
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Steve11 ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 28 May 2024 Location: Vero Beach Fl. Status: Offline Points: 1 |
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Hello, my system and ears are very jazz oriented so I appreciate your using the Monitor Audio speakers as well as the Project turntable. The only suggestion I would have is, if the tt is using the Ortofon Red it came with, I suggest a change to the Audio Technica VM540ML. For about $270 you get a cartridge with a Shibata type microline needle which, for jazz is really more expressive, because it plays more of the groove. So, the rhythm of the bass and symbol are more clear. However, because the Project table has a one piece arm with no removable headshell, it is obviously harder to change cartridge. So be careful with the thinner connecting wires. I'm using a Fluance tt which came with the Ortofon Blue, and having replaced it with the VM540, the jazz, especially small combos/trios-Oscar Peterson or like Bill Evans, are more expressive and clear.
Edited by Steve11 - 30 May 2024 at 9:20am |
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Moshkiae ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Dec 2024 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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Hi,
I have no idea what I would choose these days, especially as the majority of the music is not "clean" and well recorded as it was 50 years ago where a lot more care was usually the difference between a good band and an average band, although this usually changed after the first album for some bands! In 1976 I got me a pair of ESS Heil AMT1 speakers ... and I had to get a receiver to handle them and ... finally I settled on a Concept of some sort that was 450W ... the speakers had an unknown/unlisted suggestion that at least 300W was necessary to get a good to better sound. Next was the turntable ... Pioneer 12D which lasted until 2010 and had a pair of belts replaced in between. But the kicker was the cartridge ... a Stanton 681EEE that cost $375 in 1977 so you have an idea of its quality ... it was one of the top rated cartridges. Needless to say, I had a monster system, and the speakers were wonderful and here in Portland I had them re-coned twice since 1982 by a local shop that is still around. I chose the ESS Heil speakers, in the music store ... everyone was playing their favorite rock album and song, and I brought Tangerine Dream ... and none of the other speakers in there, including more expensive ones, showed Phaedra and Rubycon as cleanly as the ESS Heil speakers did ... and I still have them today, though the receiver is a piddler and the turntable is a reasonable Stanton ($300 some 6 years ago) but not a good cartridge at this time. My LP collection is going down and is now around 1K albums, from a top of 3500 albums at one time, but in the end, these are so heavy and without a house of my own, carrying these around is a problem. But if my neighbors don't behave, I will blow them out of the house ... I have not, yet, or if I will or not, put together a playing music studio ... I have the computers for it, but the compatibility of the majority of the keyboard stuff is horrendous and learning a DAW is worse than having to be punished with reading War and Peace three times! But I can tell you that CD's don't sound "better" than the LP's or vice versa ... the only bad part is that a lot of the stuff yo download is not high quality ... which I can tell the difference as I have recorded a lot of my collection of LP's to MP3 ... at high quality, and comparing one of those to the bit on the toob ... is disgusting ... and pathetic ... no wonder people think analog is better ... they are hearing to cheap versions of the stuff .... and all of a sudden the remasters of every kitchen recipe is better ... well I tell you a secret ... the version of Sgt Peppers, the English pressing is better than the remastered version ... way better ... and the same for Dark Side of the Moon .. it's like the American version of those LP's were taken from a trash copy at EMI, or Abbey Road! Once you know that ... choosing a system takes a different direction as to what you need or want ... but I can tell you that 50 years ago, some Tangerine Dream made some speakers fly and the music ... oh my GOD ... I'll leave that to your imagination!
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Moshkiae ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Dec 2024 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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Hi,
A wee bit more ... it's strange for me to think that a set of speakers, for example, makes a difference for something or other. In the early days, up until the explosion of pop music and cheap recordings in the late 60'd, the best recordings were of classical music, and there are stories, for example, that a few folks at Abbey Road were upset when some long hairs that did not know music got into their studios! The RCA Red Label, featured some incredible recordings, and if you can find these I recommend listening and having them, as they would give you a very good listening experience, however, some folks have the idea that some speakers are better for classical, some for rock and some for jazz. Nowadays, instead of 50 years ago, I am not sure that it matters much, since the equipment you have is already better for the recording stuff that you are going to play ... but thinking that something or other is going to be better, is weird for me, although that is how I chose my speakers. I went to the music store, and in the speaker room they had everything (we're talking 1975/1976!!!) that was considered the best in speakers. I brought my English version of the LP by Tangerine Dream (Phaedra) and played the cut from the 2nd side (Mysterious Semblance ... ) on 4 sets, and you could tell that some of them were designed for "heavy" rock music, as in loud and cheap ... and their bass sound was too strong, and not a good definition of well recorded music, but it was what at the time folks liked ... the stereotypical FM radio sound, which was tempered with btw, with a slight touch slower (not always noticeable) to make it sound heavier. Other speakers, you could tell were cheaply built and the price was just the name of the thing, on cardboard as I like to say. The only speakers that handled the mids and the combination of sounds and twists, was the ESS Heil AMT 1 that I eventually bought at the time ($325 each!!!) ... but it made Tangerine Dream come alive really well. The music that you use to select the speakers is the important part with one exception ... there is a MARKED DIFFERENCE between a stylus cartridge that costs $100 bux and the one I bought at the time, the best stylus cartridge from Stanton. It lived for almost 35 years. The quality of the stylus cartridge is massive in the selection of the rest of the stuff ... so a cheaper stylus does not bring down the music so much ... and at that point, the speakers are more forgiving, because of the detail the cartridge can give you ... and this is when you find which stuff was well done ... don't ever compare the Sgt Pepper's English and American versions ... you will want to go kill somebody for ripping off the public! And you know right away who the jerks were that did not like the long hairs getting famous and rich. Capitol Records was full of them, and the majority of those folks came from classical music, and didn't think the long hairs would make it ... check out the stories about the worst business decisions ever made ... and the Beatles and Rolling Stones are in the top 5, though I have not checked it in 10/15 years, but comparatively speaking the incredible results showed a bunch of rich farts that didn't care about the music, or the art! It is a tough choice, but make sure you get yourself something special, and not just a favorite album, or band ... where you will see the difference when you play something else that is better recorded, than the average stuff that you get on bandcamp, or any of the streaming places these days ... they are owned by the record companies and are still trying to kill the downloads of anything ... talking about living in the past ... !!! And I have not tried this on remastered albums, but you know that the remastering is a joke, since no one has redone any of the awesome classical recordings of the 1960's which ought to tell you how well they were done, as opposed to popular music. And it could be said that what Steven Wilson is doing is almost exactly what/how a lot of classical music was looked at and recorded in the 1960's ... he might make you think that he did something exceptional, but in the end, if you have not experienced the super high quality of some classical music 55 years ago, you almost have no choice but "fall" to the opinions of folks that think they are the experts ... which they are to a degree, but not enough to show me music properly ... since the majority of the music they are using is not exactly the best in terms of the idea and strength needed to expand the listening experience for you and I. And doing justice to an orchestra is far more of a great job than 4 instruments in a rock band. Remember that.
Edited by Moshkiae - 14 Mar 2025 at 11:41pm |
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Pedro Sena www.pedrosena.com
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